Explore the Unexplained
Want a 12-Month Digital Subscription to Paranormal Underground Magazine? Click here & save more than 15%!
Topic RSS
Offline
(I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. -Jessica Dovey)
"Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that ~Dr. MLK Jr."
Ask anyone: I am not a pacifist. However, this dancing in the streets, running around knees bent bullcrap is ludicrous. This event martyred Osama bin Laden. He wasn't made to pay for his crimes, we released him from all accountability. Not one family that lost a loved one on September 11th will gain closure from this action.
Something will be coming on the coat tails of this massacre, even while people are dancing on Pennsylvania Avenue but it won't be bold and in your face. It will be yet another attempt for our government to strip us of any Constitutional Rights and Freedoms we still cling to with clenched fists. It will be quiet, so the people celebrating won't even know about it until it is over.
This action did nothing to keep us safe…
This is all my humble opinion, which I still have the right to express. I espouse no love for Osama bin Laden.
I hear what you are saying and I agree with some of it. It does seem awful to celebrate someone's death, but he lived his life in a way that caused people to celebrate his death. You reap what you sow and he sowed nothing but death and destruction. He who lives by the sword shall die by the sword and all that jazz.
That being said, I really think there's more relief about his death than actual joy. I personally am very relieved that he's not out there plotting anymore. I'm relieved that they aren't dragging his sorry arse over here to put on a big show trial that would cost us millions of dollars. Just providing security would be ludicrously expensive. Then there's the whole issue of where to hold the trial. It would be impossible to try him anywhere except at some secret military prison, but there are people who would scream bloody murder if we did that. No doubt Saudi Arabia, the UN, etc, etc, etc. would all want to have input into how and where the trial was handled. It would have been a huge mess.
Even if he was sentenced to death in a trial, would we ever be able to actually execute him or would we have to endure endless and expensive appeals?
I don't think anything would ever give the families of his many victims real closure and no matter how he died, he'd be a martyr in some people's minds.
Just my opinion.
Offline
I hear what you are saying and I agree with some of it. It does seem awful to celebrate someone's death, but he lived his life in a way that caused people to celebrate his death. You reap what you sow and he sowed nothing but death and destruction. He who lives by the sword shall die by the sword and all that jazz.
That being said, I really think there's more relief about his death than actual joy. I personally am very relieved that he's not out there plotting anymore. I'm relieved that they aren't dragging his sorry arse over here to put on a big show trial that would cost us millions of dollars. Just providing security would be ludicrously expensive. Then there's the whole issue of where to hold the trial. It would be impossible to try him anywhere except at some secret military prison, but there are people who would scream bloody murder if we did that. No doubt Saudi Arabia, the UN, etc, etc, etc. would all want to have input into how and where the trial was handled. It would have been a huge mess.
Even if he was sentenced to death in a trial, would we ever be able to actually execute him or would we have to endure endless and expensive appeals?
I don't think anything would ever give the families of his many victims real closure and no matter how he died, he'd be a martyr in some people's minds.
Just my opinion.
I wonder how much he was actually plotting, and how much was other people.
I understand relief that he is no longer a threat. My problem that I've had is that after 9/11, when extremist muslims danced and celebrated in the street, we thought it was terrible, and it was. Now we are doing the same thing. To the Muslim world, that might look as callous as it did to us when others did it after 9/11.
I have to tell you – my first response was "We got him!" And then I started to watch the news and it felt icky to see people celebrate. That being said, I didn't lose anyone in a terrorist attack. Nor have my loved ones fought in the war on terrorism. I might feel very differently if I had.
Offline
I wonder how much he was actually plotting, and how much was other people.
I understand relief that he is no longer a threat. My problem that I've had is that after 9/11, when extremist muslims danced and celebrated in the street, we thought it was terrible, and it was. Now we are doing the same thing. To the Muslim world, that might look as callous as it did to us when others did it after 9/11.
I have to tell you – my first response was "We got him!" And then I started to watch the news and it felt icky to see people celebrate. That being said, I didn't lose anyone in a terrorist attack. Nor have my loved ones fought in the war on terrorism. I might feel very differently if I had.
Right! Remember when they drug the burned, hung bodies of people through the streets? And not even soldiers…I think these guys were journalists. Remember how that made you feel? Outright sick.
(On a lighter moment: not quite as sick as my husband eating spaghetti while watching Conspiracy Theory! I'm a bit off my dinner at this moment. Even movie torture makes me sick. And now I'm sad I don't have a throw up emoticon. /sad.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='
' /> )
Offline
So now the truth comes out that there was only one armed person who was quickly gunned down. Everyone else in the compound including OBL was unarmed. He didn't use a woman for a shield.
Basically, everything in the original story was a big fat lie.
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/s…..ries/U/US_…-05-05-09-23-57
I am getting so tired of being lied to by this administration!!!
Offline
I am getting so tired of being lied to by this administration!!!
Just this one? How about every single one before it too?
Offline
Just this one? How about every single one before it too?
At least previous administrations did not insult our intelligence by telling such easily disproven lies. This administration is too **** amateurish to even stick to one story!
The best thing to do is tell the truth. Explain that the SEALS were told to shoot OBL even if he was unarmed because of the likelihood that he would be wearing a suicide belt. That makes sense, right? Whatever the reason he was shot although unarmed, tell us the truth. We're grown ups: we can take it. Or, if the truth is too disturbing, make up a reason that would explain shooting an unarmed man. As much as Americans hate OBL, it wouldn't be very hard to convince us.
If you aren't going to tell the truth, at least do us the courtesy of assuming that we have the IQ of the average 12 year old. Don't insult our intelligence!
1) If you're going to tell a massive lie, agree to the story BEFORE you go public with it.
2) Make sure that everyone agrees to stick to that story, no matter what.
2) Make sure there aren't photos or other evidence that clearly disprove your story.
3) If you claim that OBL and crew were armed and they weren't, at least drop guns beside the bodies before you leave. Duh!
4) Don't tell stupid lies like "we lost video contact for 25 minutes" when you've already told us that there were multiple cameras. Do you think that we are so dumb that we will believe that every camera failed at exactly the same time and for exactly the same length of time?
47% of Detroit may not be able to read, but a lot of us not only read, we read foreign newspapers. Newspapers that have stories based on eye witness accounts and other evidence. Someone is going to find out that you lied and then you look like a fool as well as a liar.
Offline
Keef reacts to the news that the Navy Seals just took out his heroin dealer
The Best Radio On Radio
SirusXm
Offline
A few Bushisms for you. Enjoy.
"I miss being pampered." --George W. Bush, reflecting on his presidency, University of Texas at Tyler, Oct. 19, 2010
"This is my maiden voyage. My first speech since I was the president of the United States and I couldn't think of a better place to give it than Calgary, Canada." --George W. Bush, as reported by the Associated Press, Calgary, Canada, March 17, 2009
"I'm going to put people in my place, so when the history of this administration is written at least there's an authoritarian voice saying exactly what happened." --George W. Bush, on what he hopes to accomplish with his memoir, as reported by the Associated Press, Calgary, Canada, March 17, 2009
"One of the very difficult parts of the decision I made on the financial crisis was to use hardworking people's money to help prevent there to be a crisis." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Jan. 12, 2009
"I'm telling you there's an enemy that would like to attack America, Americans, again. There just is. That's the reality of the world. And I wish him all the very best." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Jan. 12, 2009
"In terms of the economy, look, I inherited a recession, I am ending on a recession." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Jan. 12, 2009
"I guess it's OK to call the secretary of education here 'buddy.' That means friend." --George W. Bush, Philadelphia, Jan. 8, 2009
"So I analyzed that and decided I didn't want to be the president during a depression greater than the Great Depression, or the beginning of a depression greater than the Great Depression." --George W. Bush, Washington D.C., Dec. 18, 2008
"People say, well, do you ever hear any other voices other than, like, a few people? Of course I do." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Dec. 18, 2008
"I've abandoned free market principles to save the free market system." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Dec. 16, 2008
"You know, I'm the President during this period of time, but I think when the history of this period is written, people will realize a lot of the decisions that were made on Wall Street took place over a decade or so, before I arrived in President, during I arrived in President." --George W. Bush, ABC News interview, Dec. 1, 2008
"I've been in the Bible every day since I've been the president." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Nov. 12, 2008
"He was a great father before politics, a great father during politics and a great father after politics." --George W. Bush, on his father, George H.W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Nov. 12, 2008
"Yesterday, you made note of my -- the lack of my talent when it came to dancing. But nevertheless, I want you to know I danced with joy. And no question Liberia has gone through very difficult times." --George W. Bush, speaking with the president of Liberia, Washington, D.C., Oct. 22, 2008
"I want to share with you an interesting program -- for two reasons, one, it's interesting, and two, my wife thought of it -- or has actually been involved with it; she didn't think of it. But she thought of it for this speech." --George W. Bush, discussing a company that improves access to clean water in Africa, Washington D.C., Oct. 21, 2008
"This thaw -- took a while to thaw, it's going to take a while to unthaw." --George W. Bush, on liquidity in the markets, Alexandria, La., Oct. 20, 2008
"I didn't grow up in the ocean -- as a matter of fact -- near the ocean -- I grew up in the desert. Therefore, it was a pleasant contrast to see the ocean. And I particularly like it when I'm fishing." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Sept. 26, 2008
"Anyone engaging in illegal financial transactions will be caught and persecuted." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Sept. 19, 2008
"We're fixing to go down to Galveston and obviously are going to see a devastated part of this fantastic state." --George W. Bush, Houston, Sept. 16, 2008
"The people in Louisiana must know that all across our country there's a lot of prayer -- prayer for those whose lives have been turned upside down. And I'm one of them." --George W. Bush, Baton Rouge, La., Sept. 3, 2008
"First of all, I don't see America having problems." --George W. Bush, interview with Bob Costas at the 2008 Olympics, Beijing, China, Aug. 10, 2008
"I'm coming as the president of a friend, and I'm coming as a sportsman." --George W. Bush, on his trip to the Olympics in China, Washington, D.C., July 30, 2008
"There's no question about it. Wall Street got drunk -- that's one of the reasons I asked you to turn off the TV cameras -- it got drunk and now it's got a hangover. The question is how long will it sober up and not try to do all these fancy financial instruments." --George W. Bush, speaking at a private fundraiser, Houston, Texas, July 18, 2008 (Watch video clip)
"I think it was in the Rose Garden where I issued this brilliant statement: If I had a magic wand -- but the president doesn't have a magic wand. You just can't say, 'low gas.'" --George W. Bush, Washington D.C., July 15, 2008
"And they have no disregard for human life." --George W. Bush, on the brutality of Afghan fighters, Washington, D.C., July 15, 2008
"The economy is growing, productivity is high, trade is up, people are working. It's not as good as we'd like, but -- and to the extent that we find weakness, we'll move." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., July 15, 2008
"Goodbye from the world's biggest polluter." --George W. Bush, in parting words to British Prime Minister Gordon Brown and French President Nicolas Sarkozy at his final G-8 Summit, punching the air and grinning widely as the two leaders looked on in shock, Rusutsu, Japan, July 10, 2008
"Amigo! Amigo!" --George W. Bush, calling out to Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi in Spanish at the G-8 Summit, Rusutsu, Japan, July 10, 2008
"Throughout our history, the words of the Declaration have inspired immigrants from around the world to set sail to our shores. These immigrants have helped transform 13 small colonies into a great and growing nation of more than 300 people." --George W. Bush, Charlottesville, Va., July 4, 2008
"Should the Iranian regime-do they have the sovereign right to have civilian nuclear power? So, like, if I were you, that's what I'd ask me. And the answer is, yes, they do." --George W. Bush, talking to reporters in Washington, D.C., July 2, 2008
"But oftentimes I'm asked: Why? Why do you care what happens outside of America?" --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., June 26,2008
"I remember meeting a mother of a child who was abducted by the North Koreans right here in the Oval Office." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., June 26, 2008
"I want to tell you how proud I am to be the President of a nation that -- in which there's a lot of Philippine-Americans. They love America and they love their heritage. And I reminded the President that I am reminded of the great talent of the -- of our Philippine-Americans when I eat dinner at the White House." --George W. Bush, referring to White House chef Cristeta Comerford while meeting with Filipino President Gloria Macapagal Arroyo, Washington, D.C., June 24, 2008
"And I, unfortunately, have been to too many disasters as president." --George W. Bush, discussing flooding in the Midwest, Washington, D.C., June 17, 2008
"There is some who say that perhaps freedom is not universal. Maybe it's only Western people that can self-govern. Maybe it's only, you know, white-guy Methodists who are capable of self-government. I reject that notion." --George W. Bush, London, June 16, 2008
"Your eminence, you're looking good." --George W. Bush to Pope Benedict XVI, using the title for Catholic cardinals, rather than addressing him as "your holiness," Rome, June 13, 2008
"The German asparagus are fabulous." --George W. Bush, Meseberg, Germany, June 11, 2008
"We've got a lot of relations with countries in our neighborhood." --George W. Bush, Kranj, Slovenia, June 10, 2008
"One of the things important about history is to remember the true history." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., June 6, 2008
"There's no question this is a major human disaster that requires a strong response from the Chinese government, which is what they're providing, but it also responds a compassionate response from nations to whom -- that have got the blessings, good blessings of life, and that's us." --George W. Bush, on relief efforts after a Chinese earthquake, Washington, D.C., June 6, 2008
"Let's make sure that there is certainty during uncertain times in our economy." -- George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., June 2, 2008
"We got plenty of money in Washington. What we need is more priority." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., June 2, 2008
"And so the fact that they purchased the machine meant somebody had to make the machine. And when somebody makes a machine, it means there's jobs at the machine-making place." --George W. Bush, Mesa, Arizona, May 27, 2008
"I don't want some mom whose son may have recently died to see the commander in chief playing golf. I feel I owe it to the families to be in solidarity as best as I can with them. And I think playing golf during a war just sends the wrong signal." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., May 13, 2008
"I'll be long gone before some smart person ever figures out what happened inside this Oval Office." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., May 12, 2008
"How can you possibly have an international agreement that's effective unless countries like China and India are not full participants?" --George W. Bush, Camp David, April 19, 2008
"Oftentimes people ask me, 'Why is it that you're so focused on helping the hungry and diseased in strange parts of the world?'" --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., April 18, 2008
"We want people owning their home -- we want people owning a businesses." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., April 18, 2008
"So long as I'm the president, my measure of success is victory -- and success." --George W. Bush, on Iraq, Washington, D.C., April 17, 2008
"Thank you, your Holiness. Awesome speech." --George W. Bush, to Pope Benedict, Washington, D.C., April 15, 2008 (Watch video clip)
"A lot of times in politics you have people look you in the eye and tell you what's not on their mind." --George W. Bush, Sochi, Russia, April 6, 2008
"Afghanistan is the most daring and ambition mission in the history of NATO." --George W. Bush, Bucharest, Romania, April 2, 2008
"Soldiers, sailors, Marines, airmen, and Coastmen -- Coast Guardmen, thanks for coming, thanks for wearing the uniform." --George W. Bush, at the Pentagon, March 19, 2008
"I thank the diplomatic corps, who is here as well." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., March 12, 2008
"Removing Saddam Hussein was the right decision early in my presidency, it is the right decision now, and it will be the right decision ever." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., March 12, 2008
"Let me start off by saying that in 2000 I said, 'Vote for me. I'm an agent of change.' In 2004, I said, 'I'm not interested in change --I want to continue as president.' Every candidate has got to say 'change.' That's what the American people expect." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., March 5, 2008
"And so, General, I want to thank you for your service. And I appreciate the fact that you really snatched defeat out of the jaws of those who are trying to defeat us in Iraq." --George W. Bush, to Army Gen. Ray Odierno, Washington, D.C., March 3, 2008
"Wait a minute. What did you just say? You're predicting $4-a-gallon gas? … That's interesting. I hadn't heard that." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Feb. 28, 2008
"I'm oftentimes asked, What difference does it make to America if people are dying of malaria in a place like Ghana? It means a lot. It means a lot morally, it means a lot from a -- it's in our national interest." --George W. Bush, Accra, Ghana, Feb. 20, 2008
"There is no doubt in my mind when history was written, the final page will say: Victory was achieved by the United States of America for the good of the world." --George W. Bush, addressing U.S. troops at Camp Arifjan in Kuwait, Jan. 12, 2008
"I can press when there needs to be pressed; I can hold hands when there needs to be -- hold hands." --George W. Bush, on how he can contribute to the Middle East peace process, Washington, D.C., Jan. 4, 2008
Offline
Top 10 Bushisms
10) "Families is where our nation finds hope, where wings take dream." —LaCrosse, Wis., Oct. 18, 2000
9) "I know how hard it is for you to put food on your family." —Greater Nashua, N.H., Jan. 27, 2000
8) "I hear there's rumors on the Internets that we're going to have a draft." —second presidential debate, St. Louis, Mo., Oct. 8, 2004
7) "I know the human being and fish can coexist peacefully." —Saginaw, Mich., Sept. 29, 2000
6) "You work three jobs? … Uniquely American, isn't it? I mean, that is fantastic that you're doing that." —to a divorced mother of three, Omaha, Nebraska, Feb. 4, 2005
5) "Too many good docs are getting out of the business. Too many OB-GYNs aren't able to practice their love with women all across this country." —Poplar Bluff, Mo., Sept. 6, 2004
4) "They misunderestimated me." —Bentonville, Ark., Nov. 6, 2000
3) "Rarely is the questioned asked: Is our children learning?" —Florence, S.C., Jan. 11, 2000
2) "Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we." —Washington, D.C., Aug. 5, 2004
1) "There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again." —Nashville, Tenn., Sept. 17, 2002
http://politicalhumor.about.co…..cs/georgew…p10bushisms.htm
Offline
With that being said, I don't know which is scarier, a liar being in charge of our country or an idiot.
And speaking of liars, what about the lies told to get us into Iraq in the first place?
Namely about weapons of mass destruction and Saddam somehow being involved in 911, both which were proven to be lies.
Just sayin'.
Offline
With that being said, I don't know which is scarier, a liar being in charge of our country or an idiot.
Lucky us, we now have both. Just my personal opinion of course.
And speaking of liars, what about the lies told to get us into Iraq in the first place?
Namely about weapons of mass destruction and Saddam somehow being involved in 911, both which were proven to be lies.
I'm no W fan, that's for sure, but I do think that both W and Blair really believed that there were weapons of mass destruction. We were living in the UK then and all the reports were that both British and American intelligence believed that Saddam had WMD's. Let me tell you, if I had been Bush and/or Blair, there WOULD have been weapons of mass destruction there if I had to hand carry them over in my luggage one by one. Think how different things would have gone then.
That's the problem leaders face: If they act on information that's wrong, they're torn to shreds. If they hadn't acted on that information and Saddam really did have WMD's and nuked NYC or London, they would have been torn to shreds, too.
The WORST part is that Americans elected the Shrub not once, but TWICE. So who's the bigger idiot, Bush or us?
After him, we elected someone with ZERO executive experience to run our government in the midst of the worst financial crisis since the depression and with ZERO military experience to be the Commander-in-Chief of our nation's military in the middle of two wars.
What could possibly go wrong? Sigh…
Offline
Lucky us, we now have both. Just my personal opinion of course.
Obama is hardly an idiot. But that is just my opinion.
I'm no W fan, that's for sure, but I do think that both W and Blair really believed that there were weapons of mass destruction. We were living in the UK then and all the reports were that both British and American intelligence believed that Saddam had WMD's. Let me tell you, if I had been Bush and/or Blair, there WOULD have been weapons of mass destruction there if I had to hand carry them over in my luggage one by one. Think how different things would have gone then.
That's the problem leaders face: If they act on information that's wrong, they're torn to shreds. If they hadn't acted on that information and Saddam really did have WMD's and nuked NYC or London, they would have been torn to shreds, too.
The WORST part is that Americans elected the Shrub not once, but TWICE. So who's the bigger idiot, Bush or us?
After him, we elected someone with ZERO executive experience to run our government in the midst of the worst financial crisis since the depression and with ZERO military experience to be the Commander-in-Chief of our nation's military in the middle of two wars.
What could possibly go wrong? Sigh…
As for them having to act. In the time leading up to the war, I could tell at least, that they were not trying to take the diplomatic path. They gave me the impression that they were going to war and damned the consequences. I think it had a little to do with Saddam plotting to kill W's daddy, but more to do with oil, and a lot to do with Halliburton (a former Chaney link) getting to rebuild Iraq after we leveled it. There is probably a lot of money that one can make from that.
I don't trust a politician as far as I can throw them. They all lie at one time or the other. Bush and his crew were not any better politicians than the current ones. If we elected someone with little executive experience in the midst of the worst financial crisis since the depression, and who has zero military experience, it was because America was tired of the status quo.
Why not elect someone with little experience? A bunch of numbskulls, who supposedly knew what they were doing, got us in the middle of that mess in the first place. Might as well let the Democrats have a shot at trying to get us out of it. All I remember is I seemed to have a lot more money when Bill Clinton was President.
Offline
Might as well let the Democrats have a shot at trying to get us out of it.
Are you f'g kidding me???
The whole financial crisis was caused by the Democrats!!! Their policies forced financial institutions to make sub-prime mortgages in the first place! Jimmy Carter created the requirement and Clinton expanded it. They forced banks to make high risk mortgages that no responsible institution would ever have made. Then Fannie and Freddie became the market for those sub-prime mortgages. By June of 2008, Fannie Mae alone owned or guaranteed more than $388 billion in high-risk mortgage investments.
Because of this, banks made more and more risky loans because they were guaranteed a buyer for those loans – Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Without them, the whole financial crisis wouldn't have happened because no sane buyers would invest in sub-prime mortgages. No buyers for these loans, no sub-prime mortgages.
But it gets worse. They were warned about the impending disaster and deliberately chose to do nothing about it.
"IN 2005 Alan Greenspan told Congress how urgent it was for it to act in the clearest possible terms: If Fannie and Freddie "continue to grow, continue to have the low capital that they have, continue to engage in the dynamic hedging of their portfolios, which they need to do for interest rate risk aversion, they potentially create ever-growing potential systemic risk down the road,'' he said. ``We are placing the total financial system of the future at a substantial risk.''
For the first time in history, a serious Fannie and Freddie reform bill was passed by the Senate Banking Committee. The bill gave a regulator power to crack down, and would have required the companies to eliminate their investments in risky assets.
If that bill had become law, then the world today would be different. In 2005, 2006 and 2007, a blizzard of terrible mortgage paper fluttered out of the Fannie and Freddie clouds, burying many of our oldest and most venerable institutions. Without their checkbooks keeping the market liquid and buying up excess supply, the market would likely have not existed.
BUT THE BILL DIDN'T BECOME LAW, FOR A SIMPLE REASON: DEMOCRATS OPPOSED IT ON A PARTY-LINE VOTE IN THE COMMITTEE, SIGNALING THAT THIS WOULD BE A PARTISAN ISSUE. REPUBLICANS, TIED IN KNOTS BY THE TIGHT DEMOCRATIC OPPOSITION, COULDN'T EVEN GET THE SENATE TO VOTE ON THE MATTER."
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/…..ws?pid=new…id=aSKSoiNbnQY0
Why didn't the Democrats want this bill to pass? Because many of the senators who protected Fannie and Freddie, including BARACK OBAMA, Hillary Clinton and Christopher Dodd, have received mind-boggling levels of financial support from them over the years. That's why.
Ironically, Senator John McCain was one of the three cosponsors of S.190, the bill that would have averted this mess. So, in 2008 Americans elected one of the very people who allowed the disaster to happen instead of someone who attempted to avert it.
But you wanted to give the Democrats a chance to get us out of this mess. Priceless.
How's that working out for you? Are you better off than you were two years ago? Is America?
We're in three wars now instead of two, the price of gas has doubled, unemployment is still at 9%, but when you add in the people who have stopped looking or are underemployed it's actually at 17%, the deficit has climbed from $400 billion in 2008 to 1.5 trillion this year, the dollar continues to drop in value, which decreases our savings by the same amount that the dollar is devalued, and our national deficit is a staggering $14.4 TRILLION.
What do Obama and the Democrat controlled Congress focus on when he comes into office? They waste the first year on health care "reform" which the CBO says will add another TRILLION to the deficit. Awesome!!!
Offline
All I know is that every time the Bush Boys leave office our country is 1) in/coming out of a war and 2) in financial dire straits. Maybe we can go for the trifecta and get Zeb in, then we can go to war with Iran and North Korea. Obviously enough people were tired of the Republicans to vote in the Democrats. The same thing happens to the Democrats whenever people get tired of their policies.
And regardless of how you say it, the wars we are in now are a direct result of Republican policies. I'm still trying to figure out the third war we are in. Enlighten me please.
Also, what do you suggest for those in America who currently can't afford or don't qualify for health insurance?
Offline
…
How's that working out for you? Are you better off than you were two years ago? Is America?
…
Great. Way better than two years ago. And yes.
Offline
All I know is that every time the Bush Boys leave office our country is 1) in/coming out of a war and 2) in financial dire straits. Maybe we can go for the trifecta and get Zeb in, then we can go to war with Iran and North Korea. Obviously enough people were tired of the Republicans to vote in the Democrats. The same thing happens to the Democrats whenever people get tired of their policies.
And regardless of how you say it, the wars we are in now are a direct result of Republican policies. I'm still trying to figure out the third war we are in. Enlighten me please.
Also, what do you suggest for those in America who currently can't afford or don't qualify for health insurance?
I agree with you about the Bushes. If Americans elect another Bush, I'll move to Costa Rica if I'm not already living there.
You can blame the Republicans for the wars, but Obama has been in office two years now and we're still fighting them. Plus, we're now bombing Libya. More money we can't afford.
There are so many things that could be done to bring the cost of health care down. Tort reform would help a lot. The average doctor pays more than $100,000 a year for malpractice insurance now, and that all gets passed on to us. All the new taxes on medical devices in the new health care law will also be passed on to us.
Allowing us to shop for health insurance across state lines would help a lot. Being able to pick the level of coverage you want and pay accordingly (the way we do with car insurance) would help tremendously. As it is, insurance policies here in NJ have to cover ridiculous things and we pay through the nose for it. Why can't we buy catastrophic policies only, for example? We could pay for our own doctor visits and be insured for major illnesses. All of these things would bring costs down significantly.
About 1/3 of health care costs go toward people in the last year of life. Hospitals are required to do everything possible to treat patients, so people like my grandmother spend weeks in an intensive care unit with round the clock care, Her heart stopped during a heart catheter procedure and they shocked her eight times to bring her back. She was brain dead from loss of oxygen, but they wheeled her into the cardiac intensive care unit, put her on a ventilator, stuck 19 IVs into her body and worked to get her heart strong again. This lasted for over a week and would have continued if we had not finally demanded that she be removed from life support. Does this make any kind of sense to you because it doesn't to me. Yet if her cardiologist had not done that, he would have been censured by the hospital. It's crazy and obscenely expensive. During her time in the CICU she had a nurse all to herself, 24 hours a day. I have no idea how many doctors saw her in that time frame, but there was a neurologist, a pulmonary doctor and several cardiologists. Medicare paid for it all. Think how many people could have received health care for what keeping her dead body "alive" cost.
Covering people who are in this country illegally is also HUGELY expensive. The comptroller for Texas estimates it cost hospitals $1.3 billion in 2006. The largest maternity hospital in Dallas estimates that half of it's patients are here illegally. In California, a 2004 study by the Federation for American Immigration Reform put the state's annual cost at $1.4 billion. Hospitals are closing because they simply cannot afford to operate because of the expense of treating illegals. It's a real issue.
Reining in our FDA requirements for bringing new drugs to market would significantly lower the cost of medicines. As it is, we foot the bill for drugs that are available to most of the world for years before we can get them.
It comes down to this: We can't afford the entitlement programs we already have, so adding another one is insane. Plus, if the mandate to buy health insurance stands, that will mean the government can make us buy anything it wants. Does that scare you? It scares the hell out of me. So does living with socialized medicine. Been there, done that, don't ever want to do it again.
Great. Way better than two years ago. And yes.
I'm genuinely happy for you. Truly. I wish I could say the same.
Offline
This has moved beyond a conversation about world news. We all have different political beliefs, and arguing about them isn't going to change anyone else's mind. I'd say let's move on. Or lock the thread. Your choice.
Karen
Offline
This has moved beyond a conversation about world news. We all have different political beliefs, and arguing about them isn't going to change anyone else's mind. I'd say let's move on. Or lock the thread. Your choice.
Karen
You are absolutely correct. We can all agree to respectfully disagree. Moving on….
The Scottish National Party did really well in the elections in the UK. I wonder what that means? They want to separate from England, most of the people in Scotland disagree but still voted for them. Now what?
Offline
This has moved beyond a conversation about world news. We all have different political beliefs, and arguing about them isn't going to change anyone else's mind. I'd say let's move on. Or lock the thread. Your choice.
Karen
No need to lock the thread. We can't all agree all of the time.
Moving on.
Most Users Ever Online: 151
Currently Online:
13 Guest(s)
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
norcalmonkey: 24961
HeidiAnn67: 15116
wrightghost: 8521
duckie7694: 5868
movieman1500: 3314
milomilford: 2589
pooperdooper: 2049
sympathyforthedevil: 1912
BornAware: 1741
ediaz65: 1447
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 3
Members: 2946
Moderators: 3
Admins: 3
Forum Stats:
Groups: 14
Forums: 47
Topics: 1886
Posts: 104920
Newest Members: czuficum, mnraztyx, eleshyendutle, annoreoli, Boiseetat, EricaMartinez, jtr194113, purswellcaracciolo346
Moderators: NoWhammies (3983), almosthunted (1138), RyanNREMTP (7427)
Administrators: admin (0), MysticalKnight (5526), sithy (1330)
Paranormal Forum - Paranormal Underground
